His Divine Grace Çréla Bhakti Rakñaka Çrédhara Deva Goswämé Mahäräj
start of side B, 13 th, 14 th.12.81
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Nitäi Gaura Hari bol! Nitäi Gaura Hari bol!
Nitäi Gaura Hari bol! Nitäi Gaura Hari bol!
Devotee : Mahäräj, when somebody comes in contact with Kåñëa consciousness movement, is that because of his own past pious credits like puëya? Or is this causeless mercy of Caitanya Mah äprabhu?
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : This is not puëyam that is called sukåti ; that is another type of puëya that is of permanent nature. Puëyam is generally reached in the relative world, the world of misconception that is good and bad, puëya is the cause of the good. But that is nirguëa, free from all this good and bad in miscalculation.
Just as in our dream we can have a good dream and a bad dream but all is false in the general sense. So here, good and bad in the calculation of this plane, wholesale is mistake, erroneous. So good and bad has not much difference, this is flickering. And that is the real good from above, transcending this sphere; that is nirguëa, guëa tértha. There is another plane which is free from misconception. Any energy we can collect from that quarter within us, that is sukåti , and that sukåti if it is accumulated to a certain stage then it produces something like çraddhä, and the nature of çraddhä is this that if I can get one the whole thing is got. That type of knowledge rises in one's heart. If we put food into the stomach the whole body is fed. So if I discharge my duty towards the central truth the whole universe will be served by me. My duty to the whole will be done. This sort of faith arises in one's mind and that becomes çraddhä, the name is çraddhä, and the çraddhä is developed and takes to be a stage of divine love. And there we can meet the whole personified, Absolute as Personified, (madhyam akriti?) to my plane, approachable by me. In this plane, in this way, we can meet Him.
Only the length and breadth and height, that is not the be all and end all of the highest entity. And at the same time, the opposite, what is living, the atom, then electron, then within electron there is something, and within that there is something. That least position, that is not the highest phase. The biggest and the smallest, that is not the highest phase. Just as elephant is not greater, a man is greater. The standard is in another way. So also, the (madhyam akriti?) the Absolute means not the biggest, Absolute means not the minutest, the Absolute may have everywhere, and His personality and in His loving personality He's found in the best conception, the central conception, the highest conception there. So we can come to meet Him there.
Am I clear? No, somewhat?
Devotee : Yes. So it is not quantity nor is it the smallest but the quality, as you say the middle.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Ah, middle. It is another plane where this physical measurement surveying has got no value. Hare Kåñëa. Hare Kåñëa.
Devotee : So in Bhägavatam it's stated that, "What kind of pious activities are performed by…
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Pious means that nirguëa, sukåti , in that sense it has been used as pious. Not ordinary, because this is all filthy. And Kant has also said that, "No work can be absolutely good." You take anything, suppose you are attending a patient, you are administering diet, service as in diet, and medicine. The medicine and diet come from the vegetable or animal kingdom, so to prepare that medicine and diet so many animals have been killed. So whatever you will go to do in this plane you cause some injury, some harm in the environment. Your existence is only creating nuisance. With the breath so many germs are being finished. With devouring food so many insects you are devouring. In this way you are putting step and the pressure of the soles so many germs are being killed, and again in the water, so many germs in the water, devouring, killing, jévo jévasya jévanam.
[ahastäni sahastänäà, apadäni catuñpadäm
laghuni tatra mahatäà , jévo jévasya jévanam]
["Those who are devoid of hands are prey for those who have hands; those devoid of legs are prey for the four-legged. The weak are the subsistence of the strong, and the general rule holds that one living being is food for another."]
[ Çrémad-Bhägavatam, 1.13.47]
No animal can live without causing death to so many lakhs of animals. So the very existence here in this plane is a nuisance and reactionary. And for this reaction, to every action there is equal and opposite reaction, we are going up and then going down, up and down, up and down, in this way the moving. The human beings taking loan from the vegetable and animal kingdom, as a reaction they have to go down, and they will again come and the loan should be cleared. In this way going up and down.
äbrahma-bhuvanäl lokäù , punar ävartino 'rjuna
[mäm upetya tu kaunteya, punar janma na vidyate]
["O Arjuna, from the planet of Lord Brahmä downwards, the residents of all planets are naturally subjected to repeated birth and death. But, O Kaunteya, upon reaching Me, there is no rebirth."] [Bhagavad-gétä, 8.16]
Päpa , puëya, in the land of misunderstanding it is going on in that way. So no action can be pure here in this mundane sphere. Everyone's movement is causing disturbance to some other soul. They are also, by their karma, have been forced to accept that position of the lower animals, lower creation. So this is not a perfect world. Everyone is doing some mischief to another. Without that none can maintain his existence here without causing disturbance to the environment, none can maintain his existence. The atmosphere is so wrong, so filthy, so we are to get out of this sphere. And what of the calculation of good and bad, that is only for the time being. I am holding higher position for a few minuets then I shall have to go back, go down, and who is in down he will come up. In this way the roaming, we are in the midst of that wave.
But we are to go out of this circular, vicious circle outside, and that is the land of service, unity, dedication, devotion. Everyone is a, just as here everyone is an exploiting unit, but in that plane everyone is a dedicating unit. Dedicating unit, that is the inner nature of every soul, dedicating unit. But here anyhow they have come, have become exploiting units, this outer world, everyone lives by exploitation, and there everyone lives by service, by dedication, the purest. And that is helping one another to be purest and purest, the diabolical difference. The land of service, land of dedication, land of devotion, it is possible, it is noble. Everyone is dedicating and they can live by that. In a train, one who wants to enter into the body, everyone thinks, 'I shall go first, I shall go first,' there will be competition, fight. And that may be just the opposite, 'No, no, you old man, you go first. I am young, I shall go last.' That attitude also may come. So there, everyone, 'No, no, I must, you go, you go ahead, you get the benefit. I shall take remaining. You take first.' The competition is of that type there. In every aspect of life they deal with dedicating spirit and that is the nature of that plane, that land.
Gaura Hari bol! And it is noble, we can think it out from here, there must be a noble. Then renunciation, that dynamic renunciation, every moment, every second the renunciation is showing its dynamic character. And generally renunciation is noted as complete withdrawal from this land of exploitation. That is to be a zero. That may be compared with a sound sleep, the stage of sound sleep. But however after long time a slept man again comes to rise, he's awake in the same sphere. So renunciation cannot be complete. It is a marginal, imaginary line, or plane.
ye 'nye 'ravindäkña vimukta-mäninas , tvayi asta-bhäväd aviçuddha-buddhayaù
[äruhya kåcchreëa paraà padaà tataù, patanty adho 'nädåta-yuñmad-aìghrayaù]
["O lotus-eyed Lord, although non-devotees who accept severe austerities and penances to achieve the highest position may think themselves liberated, their intelligence is impure. Although they may rise to the level of impersonal Brahman realisation, they fall down from their position of imagined superiority because they neglect to worship Your lotus feet."] [Çrémad-Bhägavatam, 10.2.32]
Because they have not come to the realisation of the Truth Absolute so their calculation is mistaken, aviçuddha-buddhayaù, äruhya kåcchreëa paraà padaà tataù. After much affliction and much diligence they have climbed up to the highest position of this world. But if they do not catch the current which is begun from there towards centre then he will have no other alternative but to come down to this plane again, repetition.
gatha gatam karma karma lavante?
naiñkarmyam apy acyuta-bhäva-varjitaà , na çobhate jïänam alaà niraïjanam
kutaù punaù çaçvad abhadram éçvare , na cärpitaà karma yad apy akäraëam
["Knowledge of self-realisation, even though free from all material affinity, does not look well if devoid of a conception of the Infallible (God). What, then, is the use of fruitive activities, which are naturally painful from the very beginning and transient by nature, if they are not utilised for the devotional service of the Lord?"]
[Çrémad-Bhägavatam, 1.5.12]
Gaura Hari bol! Gaura Hari bol! Gaura Hari bol!
They are the, these çlokas are the milestones, like milestones. We can gradually walk to a particular stage and then another milestone. In this way we can make progress. But if we catch a bus or an aeroplane unknowingly we can pass over……..
……..
Devotee : Some devotee, I heard from him that vitamins are already in the body, that there is no vitamins in the food.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : What does he say?
Devotee : He heard from somewhere that the vitamins are already in our body. It does not have to be supplied from external food however.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : In some particular condition it may be so. In the case of the yogés they may even take from the air the necessary food and dissipation is very meagre. In this way without taking food from outside they may stay for long time, long time. But they're also not free from creating disturbance in the environment; the (shaspashas?) so many other things. And also, more in the fine stage, the thought, even thought has got its reaction outside, not only action but the thought if it is of evil character it will have some effect in the environment and this will also get reaction, it will fetch reaction for that. Do you follow?
Devotee : Yes.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : So not only physical action but mental thought, mental waves also, they're also carrying many filthy things.
Devotee : There is that story about one çüdra who was reading Bhägavatam in Lord Rämacandra's kingdom…
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Bhägavatam, making penances.
Devotee : Making penances.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : And by order of Vaçiñöha a brähmaëa came who is the dead body of his son, "That why my son in such young age is meeting death? I am told that be the sin of the king it has been, occurred." Then Rämacandra referred it to Vaçiñöha and Vaçiñöha after meditation he says, "Yes, there is something wrong in the kingdom, a wrong wave. And what is that? The çüdra means (samuk?) he has commenced serious type of penances. Then what should be done? He should be beheaded." Rämacandra approached him and beheaded.
When I was delivering lecture in Dacca University one student from the post graduate Mohammedan student, after, when I began lecture I told, everywhere, that don't disturb in the middle of the lecture but after the lecture is finished, any religious question you may, you are free to take with. Then the lecture finished and the Mohammedan student of first post graduate college I was told he came with this question. "That according to you, Rämacandra is the ideal king we are told. But why Rämacandra beheaded that çüdra who was only engaging himself in penances?" That was his question.
I also answered according to my conscience, "That what is çüdra? Çüdra means it comes, the origination from (çütra jartu?) çütra means (soka?) one who’s a victim of moaning, lamentation, he's reckoned as çüdra. Then, who has got to lament? Who makes much of this material, transient property, who knows his wealth only this transient thing, he's compelled to lament because it will vanish, it won't stay. So çüdra is he who makes much of the material property. And with that tendency he has commenced penance. What is the meaning of the penance? A particular process by which one may acquire much power, subtle power, that is tapasya. Then the çüdra, he has begun a subtle practice that he'll get much power in his hands, as it was seen in history, that Rävaëa, Kumbhakarëa, Hiraëyakaçipu, made much penance and acquired much power. And then what was the result, the consequence of such tapasya? A great disaster was created in the universe. So many men killed, wars, devastation, all these disturbances in the atmosphere, and as the result of that he will have to suffer the consequences of that, those actions, of this. Then what is the benefit by their tapasya? Because he's of çüdra mentality his aim is the achievements of lower thing and the reaction will have to suffer in the same, so that was nipped in the bud." I answered.
Then that man was silenced. And there the Principal was some Haridäsa Bhaööäcärya of (Vaspara Paëòit?) school. Then he appreciated it very much and came to me, "To answer such questions in such a way it is not very easy. You are acquainted with different thoughts of the world. You have silenced him." In this way he eulogised me much.
So, what was the question?
Devotee : You were saying Mahäräj that thought even can create real ….
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Ah, the çüdra means that, Rämacandra……………
Boil is coming up, and by homeopathic something is dealt in such a way that it cannot come up, it's nipped in the bud, the poisonous flower nipped in the bud, something like that. He is also saved from such bad action of his own and the world is also saved from the effect of his bad action. Do you follow?
Devotee : Yes.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : So sometimes what is seen to be cruel, the mother whips the son, ostentatiously, apparently it may be very cruel, but she's saving by punishing the son, saving the son, not doing a bad action in his future time. So coercion is not always bad.
Devotee : Mahäräj, [Çréla A.C. Bhaktivedanta] Swämé Mahäräj once told a story about the boy who used to live with his aunt, and because the aunt was very lenient the boy grew up to be very bad. So at a latter age he became a murderer, he used to kill people, so he was put into the jail. And so the aunt one day came to visit the child and when the child was speaking to the aunt, she put her ear near the bar. And at time the boy took the ear off the aunt and said, "That if you were stricter with me when I was younger I would not be in this predicament now."
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Yes, history, we have read it in Bodhäyana Swämé's books of the younger age, so indulgence, (sarshan?) Even Yaçodä is whipping Kåñëa, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, what more you want? The place of ruling, controlling of the son in vätsalya-rasam, it is quite natural and it has got some effect in this plane also. Though otherwise the jail, the law, the criminal, to punish the criminal, why these things can be explained, if it has got no value?
Devotee : Mahäräj, a tree, does it have more than one soul, living entity in it? Because when you take a branch of a tree and you put it in water and then you put it in the ground it will grow another tree.
Devotee : Is there more than one soul? Because he's giving example that if you take a branch of the tree and plant it in the earth it will again grow to be another tree.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : No. But so many souls are wandering and whenever they get the chance they enter there. Not many souls in one tree or the potato and so many things, potato although cut by pieces and it is put into the earth the different tree will come, potato. But the wandering, innumerable souls are wandering, seeking the opportunity of their proper birth to come down in the atmosphere. And whenever they get some chance, yes, just as when there is union in men and women some soul enters there. They're waiting for the chances, and nature supplies that accordingly. So many prison houses and the culprit is pushed in one place, in particular cell, different classification, so many different types of prisons house rooms, and the culprit is there and he's put there, in this way.
Hare Kåñëa. Gaura Hari bol! Gaura Hari bol!
……..
…in His character, so many men attracted by that are wandering through the streets like so many birds as they make their shelter in the tree, these persons also attracted by the nature, by the beauty of Your character, they're wandering and making shelter under the tree.
bahu veda vihanga vikracaryan?
And eat by begging, don't care for their staying comfort, bodily comfort. The sweetness of Your character has attracted me. Lakñmé Devé herself, she's also attracted by Your character, what to speak of women half civilised in the jungle. That we should be attracted by the very sweetness of Your character, it is not a big thing. The sweetness of the thought, of the ideal, that has attracted and we must be faithful to our ideal. What brought us here, we must be faithful, we shall try to keep up the faith, and we may not be…
Devotee : Deviated.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Must not allow ourselves to be deviated or to go on other…
Devotee : Blind alleys.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Blind alleys. Let the Lord save us, the Gurudeva save us. There may be so much temptation that may misguide us, mislead us. Let the Lord save us from those temptations which may come when we are given chances in the higher position. A position is a very dangerous thing, pratiñöhä , from the name and fame many things may come towards us, so let us be saved from that. We may be true to our own self, true to the Master, true to our ideal; that is the highest wealth in us.
Gaura Hari bol! Nitäi Gaura Hari bol! Hare Kåñëa. Gaura Hari bol! Gaura Hari bol!
We are idealists, not realists, but ideal realism; we have faith in ideal realism, like ideal realism. Die to live. Die to live. And Reality is by Itself and for Itself. Reality is not subservient to anything else, then He's no reality. Reality is for Itself. And die to live. Mahäprabhu says:
sanätana , deha-tyäge kåñëa yadi päiye
koöi-deha kñaëeke tabe chäòite päriye ,
[deha-tyäge kåñëa nä paé, päiye bhajane
kåñëa-präptyera upäya kona nähi 'bhakti' vine ]
["My dear Sanätana," He said: "If I could attain Kåñëa by committing suicide, I would certainly give up millions of bodies without a moment’s hesitation.
You should know that one cannot attain Kåñëa simply by giving up the body. Kåñëa is attainable by devotional service. There is no other means to attain Him."]
[Caitanya-caritämåta, Antya-lélä, 4.55-56]
In this moment I am to die hundreds of times, crores of times, but this dying standard is nothing. Your physical body is false thing, and offering some false things to Him I want to say that I have done so much. That is all negative things.
Gaura Hari bol! Gaura Hari bol! Nitäi Gaura Hari bol! Nitäi Gaura Hari bol!
……..
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : (Satyavak Prabhu?)
Any one of the Äcärya's come in Mäyäpur?
Talk about Kåñëa, nothing else, He's the reality, He's the desired end of your life, not only of yours but of everyone,
na te viduù svärtha-gatià hi viñëuà , [duräçayä ye bahir-artha-mäninaù
andhä yathändhair upanéyamänäs , te 'péça-tantryäm uru-dämni baddhäù]
[Prahläda Mahäräja says: "Persons who are strongly entrapped by the consciousness of enjoying material life, and who have therefore accepted as their leader or guru a similar blind man attached to external sense objects, cannot understand that the goal of life is to return home, back to Godhead, and engage in the service of Lord Viñëu. As blind men guided by another blind man miss the right path and fall into a ditch, materially attached men led by another materially attached man are bound by the ropes of fruitive labour, which are made of very strong cords, and they continue again and again in materialistic life, suffering the threefold miseries."] [Çrémad-Bhägavatam, 7.5.31]
Ordinary people they can't understand that their real interest is inside, inside the world, not with the apparent side. Everyone, from the core of his heart, every way enquiring after Kåñëa, the Lord of love, the Lord of beauty. Everyone is in quest for that but they cannot feel them, cannot understand that. But only help them to rouse in their mind that they're in quest of Kåñëa and nothing else. Nothing can quench their thirst, inner thirst, but Kåñëa, nothing can quench the thirst, that inner confidential thirst all along, life after life, for thousands, crores of lives are going away searching, searching for something. And what is the object of that search? No less than Kåñëa consciousness, that is beauty, the love, the harmony, such guardian, who can engage the whole of your demand.
Prati aìga lägi kände , prati aìga mora. [Jïäna Dasa's Vaiñëava-padävali (Anthology ofVaiñëava Songs) quoting Çrématé Rädhäräëé: "My every limb is crying for the respective limb of My Lord; not only My Self, but every part of My Body earnestly aspires for the corresponding part of My Master's."]
Every part of your existence can have corresponding engagement only from Him and none else. That is Kåñëa conception, He can engage you wholesale. Other conceptions of gods also cannot do that, cannot do that. So Mahäprabhu came with Kåñëa consciousness, yäre dekha, täre kaha 'kåñëa'-upadeça.
[yäre dekha, täre kaha 'kåñëa'-upadeça, ämära äjïäya guru haïä tära ei deça
kabhu nä vädhibe tomära viñaya-taraìga, punarapi ei öhäïi päbe mora saìga ]
["Instruct whoever you meet in the science of Kåñëa. Teach them the instructions of Kåñëa in Bhagavad-gétä, and the teachings about Kåñëa in Çrémad-Bhägavatam. In this way, on My order, become a guru and liberate everyone in the land. If you follow this instruction, the waves of materialism within this world will not affect you. Indeed, if you follow My order, you will soon attain My association."]
[Caitanya-caritämåta, Madhya-lélä, 7.128-9]
And that is the greatest boon to the world, the greatest gift to the world ever known.
Hare Kåñëa. Hare Kåñëa. Gaura Hari bol! Gaura Hari bol! Gaura Hari bol!
The depth can be fulfilled up to the deepest portion of our life can have satisfactory engagement with Him.
Gaura Hari bol! Gaura Hari bol!
None can satisfy our thirst but Kåñëa.
Gaura Hari bol! Gaura Hari bol!
So, the ä cäryas that have got such realisation and that are trying to spread this wealth all around, how great they are, how useful they are in this world, none else but them. Hare Kåñëa.
kiti-pävana, cataro kiti-pävana?
The four sections of Vaiñëava school they are spreading this sort of idea, somewhat common and different, more or less they all are purifying this world.
Gaura Sundara. Gaura Sundara. Gaura Sundara. Gaura Sundara.
Nitäi Gaura Hari bol! Nitäi Gaura Hari bol! Nitäi Gaura Hari bol!
So you are so fortunate leaving everything aside, come to such a centre, to utilise your life in the connection of the service of the highest conception of divinity.
Hare Kåñëa. Hare Kåñëa. Gaura Hari bol! Nitäi Gaura Hari bol! Nitäi Gaura Hari bol!
Now that gentleman perhaps gone to Calcutta that Navadwépa Prabhu?
Devotee : Yes, this morning he was going.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : He has gone? Do you know about Navadwépa Prabhu, who was living at Mäyäpur?
Devotee : I was looking for him this morning but I could not find him.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Today he might have left for Calcutta, on his way to, America?
Devotee : Yes.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Gaura Hari bol! Gaura Hari bol! Gaura Hari bol!
He'll go straight to New York, or where?
Devotee : Los Angeles.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Los Angeles.
Devotee : Is it? I think he said he was going to New York.
Devotee : New York, excuse me, sorry, New York.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Nitäi. Nitäi. Nitäi. Nitäi. Mah äprabhu. Gauräìga Sundara.
Many devotees came from Dacca side. One Tértha Mahäräj, old Tértha Mahäräj, and Väsudeva Prabhu, Sundaränanda who was the editor of Gauòéya-patrikä, and many books also he composed. Then the present Äcärya of Mäyäpur, Kåñëa-kanti Brahmacäré, now Çramaëa Mahäräj. Vana Mahäräj in Våndävana, he also comes from Dacca. Many others. This Mädhava Mahäräj, he also comes from Dacca but though he was brought up in maternal uncle's house in (Paripur?) And Bhakti-sära Äçrama, he also comes from Dacca. So many.
Nitäi Gaura Hari bol! Gaura Hari bol! Nitäi Gaura Hari bol! Nitäi Gaura Hari bol!
Mah äprabhu. Gauräìga Sundara. Nitäi Gaura Hari bol!
Devotee : Mahäräj.
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Yes?
Devotee : In the fourth canto in Bhägavatam, Sunéti, the mother of Druva Mahäräj, she instructed Druva Mahäräj to go to the forest and search after Kåñëa. Later, when Druva Mahäräj attained perfection and he was going back to Godhead, and he's waiting for the, he said he would not go back to Godhead unless his mother would come also. And [Çréla A.C. Bhaktivedanta] Swämé Mahäräj writes that his Guru Mahäräj Çréla Bhaktisiddhänta would say that "I hope that I have got one disciple who is so powerful that he will take me back to Vaikuëöha with him." So my question is that in some case could a spiritual master have a disciple who was more powerful than he himself?
Çréla B.R. Çrédhara Swämé : Sometimes it may be possible. The Lord Himself becomes disciple, Kåñëa becomes disciple to Sandépané. Mahäprabhu becomes disciple to Éçvara Puré. So some incarnations or some Vaiñëava of higher position they come to do, to discharge some duty here, and they, according to show the real process they accept some Guru. In that case it will be like that, the formal acceptance of Guru. This is also possible. And also in particular cases one who has got greater sukåti then he comes here, only the same thing in the process of accepting some Guru. Then his previous tendency asserts and takes him to high position. Rasikänanda, he was also disciple to Çyämänanda, but in Rasikänanda higher symptoms of devotion were seen. It may be possible in rare cases. That is like lélä, as the Lord Himself comes and accepts Guru, so also some advanced devotees they also sometimes come here and they…
yad yad äcarati çreñöhas , tad tad evetaro janaù
sa yat pramäëaà kurute , lokas tad anuvartate
["Whatever action is performed by a great man, the general masses imitate and follow. And whatever standards the great personality sets by exemplary acts, the whole world pursues as the right conclusion."] [Bhagavad-gétä, 3.21]
So to give importance and regard for the process of accepting Guru they also do like that, and in that case it comes to the same effect. In Dhruva's case, Dhruva's mother, she showed the way ...
End of recording, 13 th, 14 th.12.81
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